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Post by Sean on Sept 6, 2007 9:52:43 GMT -5
^^ Awesome info there Noah!
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 6, 2007 11:35:07 GMT -5
WOW!
Great info!
OK.
1. Upgrade Swaybar (mine doesn't have a rear swaybar either). See 6 below. 2. Can't lower - need what little ground clearance I have. 3. Scratch this idea. 4. Lightweight rims with lower profile tires to match stock height. 5. Cool! 6. I'll look into handling kits on the Stang boards. Hear lots of good things, but a lot of guys mix-and-match parts... and I'm not looking for "full race" either.
Thanks for the info!
Give me a minute to think of my next question!!
SOHC
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 6, 2007 11:42:10 GMT -5
OK, thought of one. I read on the forum that there is a "night driving" leg of the rallys. If you folks don't know, that is a weak point of the 05-08 stangs. The lights suck to be plain. As you can see from these images: www.putfile.com/sohcman/images/143123The stock lights are HORRIBLE and the Silverstars are a good upgrade, but the light pattern is ALL WRONG for high-speed driving... WIDE vs DEEP... I quite franky don't care what is going on 300 feet to the right or left of the highway, when the lights only reach out 150 feet ahead! My pony looks enough like a GT "poser" so I don't want a GT grill (which the fogs only work on low beam)... Maybe some custom bent bracket up from the bottom with XXXX brand lights? What would you guys suggest? SOHC
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Post by ScrapinSTi on Sept 6, 2007 12:56:51 GMT -5
Well before you do that, have you aimed your headlights? Park your car on a level ground about 6" from a wall. Turn your low beams on. Take a piece of tape and mark a + sign where the "hot spot" of each headlight is. Back the car up 25ft, and the headlight hotspots should be 2" below and 2" to the outside of the + marks you made before. If they arent, follow your manufacturers procedure to adjust the headlights to aim them higher. I personally dont do it that way, but thats the way they recommend it. I just pull my car close to a wall (5' away), and adjust them until the beam is just below level with the top of the headlight, and I get about the same effect. And with the STi, it has adjustable height headlights, so I adjust them so that the lowest setting on the switch is the highest legal limit... EDIT: I also did a quick search, and found this info on stangsunleashed.com about using the GT500 HID's in '05-'07 stangs.. Im sure you could score a set on ebay for cheaper.
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 6, 2007 20:01:01 GMT -5
Oh, this is AFTER I had the dealer aim the headlights.
The night I bought it the low beams were hitting the ground about 20 ft in front of the car!
High beams were about 50 !
NO WAY! Back to the dealer.
It is the design of the lights that is the problem.
Pull a headlight off the shelf at Pep Boys or whatever and look at the "WONDERFULLY" designed "high visibility OVAL shape to the light beam.
I saw one package on just went OMFG!
The light patern looked like something out of a Star Trek episode, you know, the one with the Ameoba?
Straight line with an OVAL 50 ft in front that spread out 100-200 ft from side to side.
UNREAL!
My old 67 Corvair had 4 headlights and 2 running lights below the bumper (illegal in CT at the time).
When all switched on, I could see 1/8 to 1/4 mile ahead.
I could not outrun them at full throttle.
The light pattern was STRAIGHT AHEAD down the road, not off to the sides (the stang is also shooting squirrels out of the trees).
That is also why reflection off the reflective road signs is sometimes so bad, I have to dim my lights just to see the road!
I'm not spending $ on HID since they are way expensive and have limited lifespans.
Maybe some Hella halogen driving lights down on the bumper?
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 6, 2007 20:04:24 GMT -5
Oh, back on the topic of oversteer...
I notice my pony "floats" above 90, like its being lifted.
How about a new hood with reversed scoops to let the air out from under the hood?
Anyone ever try that?
I'm thinking front airdam too.
I just can't bring myself to say "chin spoiler"...
LOL
SOHC
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Post by ScrapinSTi on Sept 6, 2007 20:53:00 GMT -5
Aim your headlights... Dont trust the dealer. I highly doubt they did it right... They probably just did up & down, and not in and out...
And if you are feeling float on the highway, you need a REAR wing first... You wont get aerodynamic lift through your hood... It is more of air getting underneath the car. Thats why the Cobra R has such a big wing... Because its functional.
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 7, 2007 8:34:01 GMT -5
I have adjusted them slightly upward.
There is only ONE adjustment, up and down.
The lights are fixed position and the light box just sends the light sideways.
As for the wing, I'm not sure how putting downforce on the rear of the car will aid in keeping the front end down.
That's counter-intuitive to me. It would force the rear down and the front up making the problem worse.
We have a wide open grill and a smaller opening below the bumper that lets HUGE amounts of air under the hood.
With such a light front end and all that air backing up against the firewall, I'm assuming that is where a lot of lift is coming from. It is piling up against the firewall and exiting behind the front wheels. Kinda like a ducted fan engine.
A hood with reverse-facing scoops, or a cowl hood, would let the air flow smoothly out over the roofline adding downforce and reducing drag.
Our ponys aparently have poor aerodynamics even though they look great.
As for airflow over the car, they are very slippery.
I have had powdered snow all over the rear window, hit the highway at 80+, and stopped for gas (LOL) 25 miles later, and the snow was still on the window!
There is NO airflow across the window, that's why I don't want a ducktail or GT spoiler. They don't do anything and just add weight and a few holes in the decklid.
Anything that gets up higher into the airflow to be functional, just doesn't look good on a Mustang IMO.
SOHC
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Post by Sean on Sept 7, 2007 8:53:59 GMT -5
Problem solved... Get a Z
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 7, 2007 9:16:33 GMT -5
Why didn't I think of that?
LOL
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Post by skimobile on Sept 7, 2007 19:22:40 GMT -5
Oh, this is AFTER I had the dealer aim the headlights. The night I bought it the low beams were hitting the ground about 20 ft in front of the car! High beams were about 50 ! NO WAY! Back to the dealer. It is the design of the lights that is the problem. Pull a headlight off the shelf at Pep Boys or whatever and look at the "WONDERFULLY" designed "high visibility OVAL shape to the light beam. I saw one package on just went OMFG! The light patern looked like something out of a Star Trek episode, you know, the one with the Ameoba? Straight line with an OVAL 50 ft in front that spread out 100-200 ft from side to side. UNREAL! My old 67 Corvair had 4 headlights and 2 running lights below the bumper (illegal in CT at the time). When all switched on, I could see 1/8 to 1/4 mile ahead. I could not outrun them at full throttle. The light pattern was STRAIGHT AHEAD down the road, not off to the sides (the stang is also shooting squirrels out of the trees). That is also why reflection off the reflective road signs is sometimes so bad, I have to dim my lights just to see the road! I'm not spending $ on HID since they are way expensive and have limited lifespans. Maybe some Hella halogen driving lights down on the bumper? Contact Caesar at www.lightwerkz.net He does all kinds of HID mods for cars...REALLY nice work.Also, I'm suprised that there's NO rear sway bar on you car?? (but I'm not a mustang owner). IF you tighten up the rear (ie, rear sway bar) it will also help your understeer problem. A rear and or stiffer rear sway bar forces more weight onto the front outside wheel when cornering, giving you a better bite in the turns, but it will make it more tail happy (more oversteer). A thicker front bar will take some of the mushiness/flex/reaction lag out of the front suspension when cornering under load. There's plenty of nice wheels out there that are lighter than stock and should cost <$695/pc. Check out www.tirerack.com for some ideas. The nice thing about tirerack is you can select your car/color and actually see how they would look on your ride. They also give you recommended widths/tire sizes, etc., for a given rim diameter and specific vehicle. Good luck and hope it's helpfull ;D
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Post by ScrapinSTi on Sept 8, 2007 8:22:18 GMT -5
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Post by JonnyGT on Sept 8, 2007 15:42:52 GMT -5
I'd love to lower my pony, but I live on a dirt road. Bad enough I can scrape the bottom in the winter months at the stock height. How are those "low-riders" set up? Maybe I could find someone to set me up with air shocks or something so I can get up my road and into my garage if I lowered my car 1.5" ? SOHC eilbach makes a greet 2005 + kit for the v6 that only lowers an inch i would suggest looking into that. i heard that with some air and gas during the winter your car rides dangerously low due to compression difficulties and such.
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 8, 2007 21:19:58 GMT -5
OK, Combining all 3 replies: Lightwerkz just does Euro lights for imports. Nice stuff, tho I bet it is way expensive. No rear sway... Next year... eilbach... OK I'll look 'em up. Tirerack, spent several hours there perusing tire combos... didn't like the rims... too Euro for a retro pony. American Racing website: I love these... asp.americanracing.com/dealerline/blackimages/mega/mA69.jpgAnd they go up to 17x8, gotta check my bolt spacing (4.5" I think) and backspacing. Ya, I think we killed the air shock idea. Maybe I can just lower the back end, right now it is raked to the front like a 70's street machine. I don't like that look on the S197 unless you go Fat and skinnys... SOHC PS: Jon your stang looks sweet!
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Post by ScrapinSTi on Sept 8, 2007 21:58:09 GMT -5
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Post by Sean on Sept 8, 2007 22:10:34 GMT -5
I like those a lot.
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 9, 2007 13:59:54 GMT -5
That's a nice ride.
Most of the wheels for the S197 are tuner style.
Don't know why, since the car is as retro as you can get.
Lots of the rims I liked as a kid they don't even make anymore.
American Racing still has a decent selection though, so I'll probably end up there.
SOHC
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Post by ScrapinSTi on Sept 9, 2007 14:16:32 GMT -5
only problem with AR rims... HEAVY HEAVY HEAVY... Even though you cant go wrong with a nice big set of torque thrusts... They are just SO HEAVY.
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Post by JonnyGT on Sept 10, 2007 2:27:34 GMT -5
in response to sohc, thank you i love my stang, I love the retro look of the 05-07 and i think the v6 model looks sleek , yours looks sweet as well, i looked at some of the stuff posted on putfile you have. anyways i know what your talking about , my car does the same thing around 95 miles per hour. I know heat extractor hoods, and some functioning cowls do solve most of the issue, as well as lowering the car. your right. the easiest fix is the air dam something like Mach1 " chin spoiler ". it prevents air form being swept under the car somewhat. not to mention makes the car look that much sexier lol. the problem isn't really air being caught up in the engine bay, tho some does, because of the monster sized grill the s197 has, air gets trapped in pockets under the engine bay and around heat shields and such , that causes a hover like effect to happen. makes you feel like your gliding on the front end. i think your mustang would look sweet with this wing on it, i admire it a lot i'm thinking of getting it for my ride. <img src=http://www.steeda.com/images/307-0010-lg.jpg> they also make a great functioning air dam i heard . then again maybe we should just slow down and the problem would be solved right? ................................................. NAHHHHHHH !!! I did not like the Ar website either, great concept with the preview and stuff, i just dont think the selection they have at the moment fits well with the mustang. i agree with scrapinsti Am wheel are ridiculously heavy, ford racing makes a nice style wheel for the 05 - 07 . best fitments for the 05-07 is 5 x 4.5 bolt pattern which you know, and find a backspacing of like 7.27" and offest of 45mm. also i'm sure you have heard of these before however i find some nice mustang gear on these sites and thought i would share in case you haven't. a good site i found is www.americanmuscle.comalso cjponyparts.com is some what respectable. and if you don't mind DIY and Painting some discounted parts, 50resto.com has some good parts too. and modifiedMustang has tons of useful articles in there too,i kinda get jealous and want a newer model stang haha - JOn ps sorry didnt mean to write a book lol
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 10, 2007 8:26:07 GMT -5
Hey Jon,
I like books. LOL
Ya, I think a new front end is in order next year. Maybe a hood (but that's about 7 bills painted).
I need to find out the weights on the AR vs Ford rims.
Everybody and their brother has the Bullitt rims. I do like em, but I want to be a little different ya know...
Maybe I an lower the front of the car 1" and the back 2". That would get rid of the "rake", maybe make it OK on our dirt road, but I would have to level out the driveway so I could actually get it in the garage. I use two 2x8s now to clear the edge or I get <SCRAAAPE>!
The wing is nice, but I really like the Steeda Street Cowl Hood.
The drop in temperature will be good as well.
Just need a tuner and we will be rockin'!!
Thanks for the ideas.
SOHC
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Post by skimobile on Sept 10, 2007 17:53:49 GMT -5
I don't mean to be a smart-A#s but if you're having a problem with the front floating/lifting at speed, why would you want to lower the rear MORE than you plan on lowering the front.....won't that just make your situation worse instead of beter? Is the rake just FORDs inexpensive way of trying to address the issue? Also, if you do play with ride heights don't forget to get a re-alignment done when you're finshed, because it will throw things off.
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Post by ScrapinSTi on Sept 10, 2007 20:48:31 GMT -5
I didnt even think about the rake factor sean... Thats a good point...
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 11, 2007 12:12:09 GMT -5
The rear of our ponies is almost 2" higher in the back.
It may have looked cool in the 70's but it sucks now.
So even if I drop the front 1" and the back 2", the front may end up at the same height as now since the angle of the chassis will lift it up a bit.
Of course, I don't want to rip out any fuel lines in the back.
Anybody make steel skid plates for S197 mustangs?
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Post by JonnyGT on Sept 11, 2007 12:37:20 GMT -5
like for the door sill plates?
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Post by SOHCman on Sept 11, 2007 13:40:12 GMT -5
No, sorry, I meant skid plates like they have for the underside of 4x4 trucks.
Steel plates bent and shaped to cover the soft and dangely workings of a vehicle.
The frickin' rocket scientists that designed the new stang left all this really fragile stuff, like fuel lines, HANGING down behind the axle... REALLY LOW to the ground.
Just picturing a stick jutting out of my dirt road or a frost heave or a rabbit...
RRRRRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIPPPPPPPPP!!!!!!!!!!! Sputter, sputter... cough... die...
Maybe I can get creative, but I've never worked with sheet metal before.
Don't want to cause more damage if I can help it.
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